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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
We recently helped Uprev find a MAJOR bug in their software. Uprev is now actively working on a fix, we finished performing several tests for them this afternoon. Before I tell the story, here is what you need to NOT DO:

  • DO NOT datalog or live-tune the car.
  • DO NOT flash a rom onto the car then immediately drive it, you must do a ecu reset, then you can drive it.
  • DO NOT harass Uprev if you are having tuning issues, they know about the problem, and a bunch of people calling in will only slow the process down.

Symptoms of the issue;
  • When datalogging, your boost value (pressure not voltage) will either display as zero, even while the car is under boost, or will display an inaccurate number, even if the MAP sensor voltage is where it should be for the boost you are running.
  • When datalogging, your boost demand will either be stuck at 0 or will be only a fraction of what your actually demanding. So if your demanding 20psi, it may show as only demanding 10 psi.
  • When datalogging, your throttle position may be reading as not fully opened. It will also show spikes and drops in the position voltage, but the throttle is actually working.
  • When datalogging, boost solenoid duty cycles may act weird. (we only saw this one time on one car)
  • When finished datalogging and car is flashed; the car will only demand as much boost as what you saw when logging, and if the vehicle is not calculating a pressure, it will run very very rich, may run too aggressive of timing, and will struggle to make boost.
  • When finished datalogging and the car is flashed; it will feel like your tune made the car slower, not faster.
How this issue was discovered;

We have been doing the finishing touches on the engine side of things in a drag juke we are working on. On August 14th we where doing some testing on the dyno which involved some boost tuning and aux fuel tuning. The first pull, the car made well over 400 horsepower, as it had previously. The second pull, the car made in the high 300's. Third pull, low 300's. No matter what we did it kept losing power after each pull. We set it aside to look into the next day so we could get other stuff done.

The next morning, we fired the car up and started really checking out the logs. This is after we did a low pressure smoke test, replaced the plugs, did a compression test, and did a high pressure smoke test. Immediately it was noticed that the car was reading 0 boost at all rpms. That was odd. So we changed the logging to show only; boost target, boost voltage, boost pressure, rpm, accel voltage, throttle voltage. The thought being, the throttle was not opening all the way. For those of you who know tuning lingo; this car has its ETC system turned off due to how large the turbo is, we did this specifically because we had run into a throttle position issue at the beginning of the year.

So we did another pull. the throttle was showing only partially opened, the boost was at zero, the MAP sensor was at rising as it should, and the boost target was only half of what it should have been. But looking at the dyno graph; the pre-boost torque was just the same as before, telling us that the throttle was, in fact, opening up all the way. Weird. After 3 hours of messing with everything we could, we assumed it was an issue with the ECU or a ground, and called it. We had a dyno day we where hosting Saturday and had to prep for that. Thank you to those of you who came btw!

Saturday comes around. Ben shows up with his 500whp Juke, eager to take people for rides. After his third trip to Mexico I told him I wanted to log a pull just to verify everything was as it should be. He hooked the car up and went for a ride. When he got back he complained the car felt really slow that time and was running rough at full throttle. I looked at the log. Boost was reading 0. I told him I would have a look at it later, but according to the AFR readings the car was good to go. I did not even make a connection to the issue the drag car was having at this point. He got back in the car and took more people for rides.

One of the cars that was going on the dyno asked if I could touch up his tune, he recently had to replace his hpfp and a sensor and just wanted it checked out. I hook the car up. Do a pull. The car made maybe 230 horsepower, when previously it was making 270 (mamba 21T (ew) car). The logs where showing a boost target of only 14psi at first, rising to only 18psi at redline. Not how it was programmed. I tried EVERYTHING to get the car to work right. The logging just never appeared right. Now I was starting to make connections in my head. Something is up with uprev or my cable. Luckily I have a spare cable, and uninstalling and reinstalling uprev takes all of 5 minutes. So, after doing all of that I try again. More issue this time. Now the car is not showing boost, the throttle is acting funny, and on top of that his car started PEGGING RICH. After pulling out loads of fuel, it was determined that he had a leaky injector. This car has been having fuel system issues since before it first came to us a few months ago, so its an ongoing thing. Anyways. We did some more power pulls on another stock Juke, along with doing a demo about how poorly the OEM intercooler works. It was pretty fun to have people see an uninterrupted example of that. I digress.

Next we pulled a car on the dyno that had made 423 horsepower a few months back. He drove all the way up from Georgia for the dyno day. Plug the car in and just start logging the car as a check for everything. Mind you, the car drove up here totally fine, keep that in mind as we continue. I did the first power pull. 320 horsepower. Ummmm.... I start fiddling. We do a smoke test, find a slice in the oem PCV valve hose (a common issue, write up for that coming soon). We fix that do a pull. 360 horsepower. Ummm....So I start looking at the boost in the logs again. We are targeting 27psi in the tune. According to the datalog, it was actually only commanding 17psi. Which, for those of you who don't know, on bigger turbos with this sort of engine every 1 psi is usually about 10 horsepower. Which added up nearly perfectly with the loss we had. So. For 5 hours we tried EVERYTHING. swapped cables again. Battery resets. Computer restarts. Software install. Everything. It just would not demand more boost than that, no matter what I tried. Jeff (the owner) and I look at each other..."theres a uprev software issue".

For those of you keeping score; that's 4 different cars with 4 different roms, with 2 different cables, on 2 different days. So. Jeff goes home.

Monday I call uprev. I send them logs. I argue with them. They claim its a tune issue. I argue its not. Finally I send them 4 cars logs, 4cars roms. A few days later, while I am waiting to hear back, I have Jeff re-flash his ECU using his computer, his cable, and a tune file from months ago. Then do a log. Same issue. So now we are at 5 cars, 5 roms, 3 cables, 2 computers, 3 days, 2 states. I get Jeff on the phone with uprev for a three way call. Long story short (ironic I know), they are now thinking there's a software issue based on what I am telling them. They tell me they will look into it.

The next day I get a call from a gentleman in new york. This next part will be a condensed version of what happened to avoid certain parts of the story not relevant to this Uprev issue. Just saying this for the sake of clarity if the story seems to jump around. He is having his car tuned, and the cars throttle will not open all the way. I shrug it off as the tuner not knowing what he is doing, and leave it at that. His tuner is telling him the ECU is bad. Which its not. The car was driving fine BEFORE IT WAS TUNED. I wish him luck, as the cars not here I can't really help much. Then it dawns on me. HE IS HAVING THE SAME DAMN ISSUE. This was several hours later. I get back on the phone with him. He describes the issue, as best he can. He is not a tuner I don't expect people to know technical vocabulary, that would be unfair of me. He sends me a datalog. His tuner never logged boost related systems because he requires people to run an aftermarket boost controller for some reason.

I get off the phone with him and call uprev. I tell them I have a 6th car. This makes for 6 cars, 6 roms, 4 cables, 3 computers, 4 days, 3 states. The gentleman on the other end says something along the lines of, yea this is a software issue, but to confirm we need someone with a boost gauge to do a test for us. Their shop Juke was currently down. So I volunteered. I wont go into what they wanted, that would be half a page on its own. But. I did the test. And sure as ****, got the result that confirmed it is a software issue. About an hour ago we got off the phone with them, telling them this. And for the time being, follow the instructions at the top of this post.

We will be checking in with Uprev daily until they have this resolved, and have offered our drag car as a test bed to get it fixed. No matter who you use for tuning, I do not want to see anyone have catastrophic failure. So. Please sit tight, and hold off on any tuning related activities you may want to do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
If anyone wants the specifics of WHY this is effecting the cars, or at least what Uprev thinks is happening. I can write that up later. Let me know if you want that. I just need a break from typing after that book. lol
 
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Lets hope Uprev fixes the issue(s) otherwise we cannot tune or retune what we have.
 
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My only question is how far back does this affect tunes? Like was this an issue that just recently popped up with an update to the UpRev tuning software, or has this been around for years and just now being discovered? I haven't been connected to an UpRev cable/software for tuning or data logs in about 3 ish years. But from what you are describing, I wonder if I'm affected. I remember my initial data logs with Drunkmann (I still have them if you want to see them) showed something like a difference between commanded and actual boost and sometimes being a difference of 10psi. There's a few other oddities like jerking at high rpm that may or may not be attributed to this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
From what Uprev has told me, its a recent thing. They did a fairly large update about 3-4 weeks ago from my understanding.

I have seen discrepancies in boost demand in the past, and 9/10 times its from coolant or air temp related issues. When the car is cold, for example, it drastically lowers the boost you can demand by a pre-determined percentage. So if the car is not at operating temp, it won't demand full boost. Same for is the intake temps are too high, it will lower demanded boost. You can turn this safety off...but its there for a reason haha
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Okay, so what i was told was; they suspect it has something to do with the memory on the cars computer being over-whelmed by the demands being made by the software. I had a customer on the call with me, so if anyone needs verification that I was told this, I can have him swing in here. Yes, uprev knew he was on the phone, he had a piece of information relevant to the tests we where doing for them.

Here is how I am interpreting this based on my understanding of how the software links the ecm to the laptop. Again, this is my interpretation, the specifics may not be right, but im fairly certain the general idea is right.

When you communicate with the vehicles ecu, the uprev rom-editor software sends a command signal to the ecm to return certain packets of data. This would be the logging information. Typically the software only demands information selected on the logging menu.

When they say the ecm memory is being overwhelmed, I see that as; the software is demanding too much information from the cars ecm at once, causing the ecm ram to basically be over-clocking. AS a safety, weather this is on purpose by nissan or just a coincidence, the ecm starts only processing certain information in an attempt to have enough memory to operate the vehicle. In this case it is seeing the boost calculations and engine loads in boost as non-vital and is skipping it. The car will run and drive without this information being processed. The issue arises when you try to put the engine under a heavy load. It is not accessing the sections of the tune that are required for this. Which causes all sorts of issues. Obviously.

The big problem is, the issue continues to effect the car even after you are done interacting with it via uprev. As of right now, if you clear the memory of the ecu by disconnecting the battery and draining the system, the car will revert back to reading the tune as it should. Which tells me that the software is doing something related to the memory part of the ecu. Now. This means the car will run off the map. But 99 times out of 100, your datalogging or flashing because you are tuning. And since logging causes the issue, you can no longer log your pulls to properly tune. So you can do one of two things;

1. tune the car using the dyno and an external wideband and PRAY your not on the bleeding edge of knock, or that your not maxing out any sensors like MAP or MAF.

or

2. Leave the car alone as it is, and be very gentle driving it around until this issue is resolved.

Listen. This sucks. A lot. I have a customers car here that's been here for a while, and we where literally prepping for it to leave when this happened, and we always always always do a long distance drive and log before a car ships out, and now we can't, because we won't let a car leave without knowing for sure it is 100% reliable. This is just one of many vehicles we have lined up. So. a lot of people are feeling this. Business's are losing money. You can't drive your car the way you want (if you have plugged in). You can't get that tune you where ready to do. You can't log your car at the track.

But. Be patient. The issue has to be resolved. It may just take time.

And remember; tuning a car improperly is not worth the risk of damaging a very expensive engine. So, don't do it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Just called Uprev to get an update. It was not what I wanted to hear, but i was told: We are working on completely validating the issue is the software, we are working with several other customers to see if the issues are related. We will be sure to release information once we have it, or try calling back in a few days.

I'm paraphrasing....but it is extremely frustrating that they say one day its a software issue. A few days later they won't say it outright. Again. I had a customer on the phone with them when they said it was a software issue.

They seem to be telling everyone something different, which is making me think they have no clue on how they are fixing it. But I have received more calls from other people reporting the issue. So. Its definitely what they first said. I am guessing this is now butt coverage mode. But again. I am not them, and can only speculate.

But for their lead tuner to tell me not to log or live-tune, then for a support person to say they don't know, is sort of making me think they are not communicating internally about it.
 

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It isnt affecting their bottom line yet so they dont care.
 

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Hey! 2J tuned juke here. We’ve been going back and forth with Uprev since July trying to get ARC features working properly for the platform as well. Last I heard, it’s on their list. They said as far as ARC goes, it will be fixed, but they don’t have a specific timeframe on when.
Here’s hoping all of this is resolved soon. Issues like these affect the whole community, which just sucks
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I will be calling them again Tuesday for an update. I am testing a work around either tomorrow or Tuesday that may allow me to back-update the software to see if that will work in the meantime.

Since the last update there has been another Juke owner who has reached out with issues. So. It is still there, weather they want to admit it or not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I tried a few things today; I uninstalled uprev, and did the install without internet. You cannot do it. The software wont do its first boot up without an internet connection from what I can tell. If someone can find a way to do it otherwise please let me know.

I then tried doing a system restore to two months ago. With the internet disconnected. The update software just got stuck because of no internet. So. Onto the next thing to try. I am going to put a car on the dyno tomorrow and attempt to datalog as few items at a time as i can to see if it will work. The car that will be used has not been plugged into a computer for 4 months now, and last time it was on the dyno it made 416 horsepower. So. I will do a pull BEFORE plugging it in. A pull with it just plugged in. A pull with the tune file open. A pull with datalogging. And I will record the results to see if I can find a workaround for this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Did more testing today. We are switching to ECUtek over here.

We used a 7th!!! car today to verify a few things. This car has been sitting waiting for body work for 4 months. It has not been driven. It has not been flashed. It did not even have a battery in it until yesterday. I asked the owner (who was at the shop) if he wanted to see if we could find a work-around to the uprev issue. He sad lets do it. So I was extremely scientific about all of this. Graphs to come. I don't have time to convert the PDF's to a post-able image tonight. The owner was with me the whole time we did this, so he can verify the information. The laptop had been freshly updated. Uprev had been re-installed with a fresh install file. Uprev had updated. It went from version 3567 two days ago to a newer version...i am blanking on the number...3691 seems to be in my head. Either way. A new update had been made.

We put the car on the dyno at 4:00 pm. After letting it warm up and doing some gear rowing, we deemed it ready to go.

First pull; NO computer or anything plugged into the obd port. It made a mint 405 wheel horsepower. Effortlessly.
Second Pull: Uprev cable plugged into the obd port. Laptop open and on. NO SOFTWARE running. Same power. Same Curve.
Third Pull: Uprev software booted up, rom file open, datalogging open. NO DIRECT interaction between software and ECU. Same power. Same Curve.
Fourth Pull: Datalogging 7 parameters. Slightly less top end power, and the boost level was a little low. Could have been from heat soak. We only had one of our fans running.
Fifth Pull: Flashed the SAME EXACT TUNE onto the car that was already on it. Fired it up. Idled. Only made 260 horsepower. It started knocking really bad and PEGGED the wideband rich at 5000 rpm. Let off right then.


So. we now have a 7th car with the issue. Uprev is not giving us or anyone else information. There has been no notice given to anyone. So. I am done dealing with this. I have been un-able to reliably tune cars for coming up on a month. I have had to cancel several tuning sessions. Some big R and D projects we where working on are frozen solid. Next week we will be spending a large amount of time doing ECUtek training, and dialing in the software on the shop car.

I will of course keep everyone apprised of the situation if we hear anything, as I know many of you are on uprev. I genuinely hope they get this fixed. ASAP. I do. But. We will no longer be using them unless we absolutely have to.
 

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And yes, I would be that gentleman from NY. This is rude. We flashed the car with UpRev roughly 4 or 5 times. Each time my throttle response got worse and worse. Though I didn’t really notice it until the last rom. Now to the point where i start accelerating and then the engine just stops accelerating at about 3300 rpm, even though my foots to the floor. The last test rom sent to me from UpRev themselves almost stalled out the car. Engine bucking and shaking. Struggling to stay running. Point being; Under wide open throttle, the throttle position voltage sensor would peak around 4.14 volts. After bringing the engine speed up to 3300 rpm’s the tps voltage would then drop to roughly half of that at wide open throttle. Not a tuner so, still don’t know if it’s the software itself or the tune. But! Finally was able to flash the damn thing back to stock after a long hellish process of trying to determine the true source of the issue. Well. The car is flashed back to stock. UpRev’s ROM is no longer on the vehicle computer and I did a datalog. Steady (ish) 4.05ish volts under wide open throttle all the way to 6000 rpm. Somethin’ ain’t right here. I rest my case.
 

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The damage is done. Uprev wont admit to anything. It will be a soft patch and things will magically start working again.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
It is insanity. If I get time later I will try calling them again, but after what @thatonejukefan has told me, they have no idea whats happening.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
So. Started the process of flashing ecutek onto cars today. It did not start off well. I did a back to stock flash with uprev. removed the $300 license from the car. Went into Ecutek. Security error. Emailed my ECUtek guy, says its because theres other software on the ecu. I show him there isnt. He simply replies "Thats the only reason for that error."

The customer support with these tuning companies is just bewildering. I spent $4000 to become an ecutek tuner....and that's the support a tuner receives lol

So either uprev is causing WAY more issues than we thought and is corrupting the ecu's, or the back to stock function is not working right.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
We had a back to stock flash brick an ecu. We called them, they responded with "Oh, yea, sometimes windows 11 computers don't completely do the flash. So. That's yet another different thing they have told us. We have completely switched to EcuTek.
 
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